Who Wants The Display Model?

So it would appear that our little world of foreign blogging in China is having its ass raked across the coals lately. Thanks to one man and his sexual exploits displayed on the net for all to see. And I say, good on ‘im!

Basically, some uppity Chinese "professor" stumbled across Sex in Shanghai, a foreigner’s blog out of Shanghai that details his interactions with China, pointedly slanted towards the sexual nature.

The professor disliked SiS’ references to Chinese women and the sexy things they do, and even more so was not pleased about SiS’ allegations that Chinese men are a little lost in how to bed a woman, and once bedded, are quite useless.

Today, with tremendous anger, I will tell you the story of an immoral foreigner and I call upon all Chinese compatriots to get together and kick this immoral foreigner out of China.

This piece of garbage’s favorite show is to use obscene and pornographic language to describe the bodies of Chinese women and how they made love.  For example, "My dearest Tingting, you have a very good and beautiful body.  I cannot stop thinking about your beautiful skin, your lovely, smooth and soft breasts, you sexy, smooth and fine waist, your sweet and pretty legs and arms … oh, of course, you are so pretty, so sexy and so perfect between your legs!"

I can understand that some women do this for the money and others do this in order to be able to go overseas.  But, our female compatriots, when you make friends with foreigners, please always remember this: Are you willing to be the female star in a pornographic blog? Do not let others play with your body first, and then with your dignity. I also have something to tell the Chinese men: Please think about how these foreign trash have dallied with your sisters and made fun of your impotence.  Do you want to say that this is no big deal?  Do you still want to treat the foreigners as important?  Do you still quiver when you see foreigners?  Please straighten out your backbones. What a tremendous shame this has been!

Those are a few quotes from ESWN’s translation of Professor Zhang Jiehai’s blog post "The Internet Hunt For The Immoral Foreigner" (in English here, in Chinese here).

I’ll admit that my only knowledge previously of Sex in Shanghai was a mix of resentment and envy that his blog was constantly on China Blog List‘s top 10, and I’ve not been. Incidentally I’m considering changing the title of my blog to "Super Sex In Shanghai".

Today I visited SiS and there is a well-said response to Mr. Zhang’s post and its rather lynching like tone for a call to arms amongst Chinese netizens to "hunt to find this foreign trash until we kick him out of China."

I don’t want to get into the he said/ta shuo argument here. Rather, what I couldn’t help but think about while reading these two things was a Bullshit episode I recently watched. Bullshit, for those not in the know, is an awesome TV series hosted by Penn & Teller, in which they pick an every-day issue and debunk it as complete bullshit.

The episode I watched recently (thank you BitTorrent) was regarding abstinence. The show talked about how teaching the "No Sex Before Marriage" line is essentially cruel and unusual. It denies people of consenting age a pleasure they’re entitled to as a human right, but more importantly it often denies them access to information on how to make that experience safe under the ignorant guise that what they’re teaching is the safest way (and therefore the ONLY right thing to do).

China, like many parts of the West, has a very puritanical view towards sex & abstinence, and it’s nothing but archaic. It’s nearly completely one-sided (in emphasis and practice) towards women and it’s just stupid.

As this is a China-centric blog, I’m going to use Chinese examples, but please don’t think I’m high and mightily preaching this as limited to China. It’s certainly present in my home country and likely near every other as well.

When I first arrived in China I heard again and again from Chinese people how being a good Chinese girl means being a "traditional" Chinese girl. This, of course, was a euphemism for "keep your damn foreign paws off our women folk". There was a strong "look but don’t touch" attitude (‘Isn’t she beautiful? Yes, she’s a traditional Chinese girl.’) and though it’s spouted off as being "traditional" (sometimes called "religious" in the West), in fact it’s complete chauvinism that’s been embedded into our "culture".

No one ever says this about men for the simple reason that woman accept that most men will have sex before they’re married. However, men get all proprietorial when it comes to their women. It’s a bit like when I go shopping for… well… near anything. I never take the box in the front that’s been opened a bunch of times to be looked at, and I would never, NEVER buy the display model.  Most people want virgin products when they’re at the supermarket, and it’s unsurprising that this attitude is carried over to girlfriends and wives in cultures that make the women little more than a product.

Going back to the Sex In Shanghai posts issues for a moment, I think it’s important for the society in this country to recognize (before they lynch us foreigners) that Chinese women like to have sex. They really do. I’m not speaking directly from experience (I’ll leave that for SUPER SEX IN SHANGHAI!), but it’s stupid to assume otherwise. It’s often alleged that foreigners ‘lure’ Chinese girls with promises of a "future together" … fuck off. Maybe that’s how the Chinese girl justifies taking her panties off in the first place, and how she faces the family-inflicted shame when it ‘just doesn’t work out’ (irresponsible foreign bastards), but I’d hazard a guess that when she’s all hot and bothered and in the moment, a kid, a dog and a nice house are not on her mind.

Simply put: protecting the chastity and morality of a society’s women is for the benefit of men – men that want a "clean" and "pure" virgin for a wife and can’t handle the thought of a) another man touching their loved one, and b) not equating to that image.

29 Responses

  1. Pingback: fiLi’s world » Blog Archive » China : Sex, Pride and a bit about Israel

  2. I have to think that if this cad had just some fun on the web with a few of his girlfriends then this would be a non-issue. What got him in trouble was making fun of Chinese guys. I’ve had to do a lot of reading and research on gender and sexuality in Chinese history (UC Davis is a kind of epicenter for this sort of thing) and these issues are not new. Patricia Ebrey, a historian of the Song, once theorized that the spread of footbinding as a standard of beauty was a way to ultrafeminize women at a time when Chinese males were feeling a little less than masculine (having just lost the whole North of China to Jurchen invaders). In many colonialist settings, in China and elsewhere, the cavorting of local females (who tend to marry and, nowadays, date hypergamously) has always been a source of anxiety. (Though not, to be sure, as much of an anxiety as the apoplexy that Westerners had when their women had relations with native males!)

    The 面子 of the Chinese male is a tricky thing and foreigners unwittingly (and sometimes too wittingly) tread upon the machismo culture of Chinese manhood in a way that is hard to ignore.

    That said, after reading the manifesto on ESNW, I gotta think the overreaction by Zhang Jiehai says more about Chinese male anxiety than anything SiS could have drafted.

  3. Hi Ryan,

    Glad everything’s going well. This posting certainly struck a chord, I’ve many ‘traditional’ Chinese friends. One of them poignantly said that she envied western women because they could have a few boyfriends before they finally picked one for a husband, whereas she had felt obliged to marry the first boy she ever had a romance with in college.

    Like a lot of things in China, it is so reminiscent of life in England in the 1950’s when ‘nice girls’ didn’t have sex before marriage, and anyone who did was considered a trollop. I can also recall the shock and horror when white English women first started dating black men, although some of these black men were British born and bred. And I suppose you could compare the foot binding to the Victorian practice of lacing women so tightly into corsets that some of them suffered permanent damage to their internal organs.

    I feel that this may be the last generation of Chinese women who will fall for this archaic way of life, anyway I hope so.


  4. Hi guys–

    This issue isn’t about the sexual freedom of modern Chinese women. You guys raise some interesting points about the traditional v. modern gender roles in Chinese society, but that’s tangential to the main issue here.

    The main issue is that that the original Chinabounder is an asshole, and that’s what’s inciting the anger. Maybe Prof. Zhang is overreacting to call for a manhunt, but I kind of think Chinabounder had it coming. When you swoop into a new place, adopt a set of sexual behavior that *most* cultures in the world view as loose (let’s be honest– even Western cultures use the words “player” and “whore”as insults for a reason), then publicly brag about it while insulting the prowess of the local male population— you’re…. gonna get roasted for it. Period. I’m American, and I can tell you that there’s been a long history of white men lynching black guys for dating “their” women. Is that right? No. But I think that proves a point that “territorial” attitudes toward women aren’t limited to this side of the Pacific.

    Maybe Chinese women *do* want more sexual freedom, and maybe there are facets of Chinese gender roles that need to be changed. Sure, I’ll grant that much. But that does NOT justify, in ANY way, the right of some jerk to behave like an asshole. It seems to me like Chinabounder is using cultural differences as a justification for being a tool that plays around with women. While the patriarchal attitude of Chinese men toward their women isn’t right, Chinabounder’s view of them as merely sex toys doesn’t do them any justice either. To view him as some sort of a martyr for the cause of sexual liberation is being rather myopic.

    Besides, he admits in his own blog that he (and other expats in China) rarely ever date Western women. Am I the only person who thinks that that might be because Western women wouldn’t stand for any of his bull?

    My two cents.

  5. @Joan
    Having been an expat in china myself, I can say that most of the western women in China are unattractive, mostly because they are fat asses. The few attractive/slim women are surrounded by an army of western men flashing cash and talking big. Unless you were Brad Pitt you are just another face trying to buy them a drink.

    As for sex with local girls, it is true that chinese girls want to fuck foreigners, but I think it has more to do with 1. rebellion against social norms. How many western girls date “bad boys” just to spite their daddy? 2. Western men are more generally open minded and don’t pull out all of that “traditional” garbage. The sensitive machismo of chinese men is also at fault for driving chinese girls to western men, and as one girl told me “chinese men are boring” and another told me “western men are bad boyfriends but chinese men are bad husbands” referring to cheating.

    Of course, if it wasn’t for the CCP and its mind-altering education/brainwashing as well as isolatin this ancient, decaying, defunct, inflexible, oppressive culture, this might not be such an issue.

    And like everywhere else in the world, a nonwhite guy who dates/marries a white girl is a big hero, a nonwhite girl who dates/marries a white guy is a traitor and sell out. The “village values” of the world are crap.

  6. @kebab boy:

    1. If you think all Western women in China are fat asses, you’ve been hanging out with the wrooooong crowd, buddy. Last time I went to a bar, the slim/attractive Western women definitely outnumbered any unattractive women, and you know what? NO ONE was approaching them.

    2. Some Chinese girls probably do want to experiment with dating and having sex with foreigners. I’m not disputing that. Many of them *do* envy the more liberal-minded attitudes adopted by Western societies toward sex and dating. But it’s important to realize that NOT ALL Chinese girls feel that way. Just like how not all Western girls are into the casual sex dating scene. A lot of the people defending Chinabounder talk about it like all Chinese girls are just crying out for sexual liberation at the hands of a foreigner, and that somehow justifies the fact that he behaved like a Grade A asshole. IT DOESN’T.

    And as for Western men being open-minded… don’t confuse open-mindedness with a lack of sexual morals. Chinabounder’s blog entries show that he is anything *but* open-minded. I’ve read his entries (thank you Google cache), and it sounds like he’s a bigot who has already formed his opinion of What China Is, and he’ll use any- and everything in his experience here to support his pretty picture.

    3. Don’t blame communism for traditional Chinese values. It seems like every time some western boy gets annoyed that he can’t get laid in China, it’s CCP-this and CCP-that. You want to see an example of “ancient, inflexible, oppressive” culture? Go to a conservatively Islamic country and try to have a casual affair with a woman there.

    4. I don’t know where you come from, but in the good ol’ U.S. of A., there is a LONG history of black men getting lynched for dating and/or marrying white women. Usually by other white men. Hero status? I think not. In this example, the white women are often viewed as having degraded themselves and sold out by dating/marrying another race as well, so your generalization doesn’t really work if you think about it.

    All that being said, I don’t really care who in China is sleeping with whom– that’s solely the business of the parties concerned. But don’t. Be. An asshole about it! Chinabounder used girls for sex, then published it on a public forum without the girls’ knowledge or consent. I don’t know of any cultural system where that is really condoned– even in the US with all of its “free speech” laws, that kind of behavior is unquestionably rude and would earn you some very angry responses. What’s worse, is that he used his limited experience to make rude, racist generalizations about an entire country, culture, and government system. If you make bigoted remarks about ANY group of people, they’re going to get pissed off, and there will probably be at least one or two individuals who will want to call a manhunt. Does that REALLY come as such a shock to anyone?

    Now, do I support Prof. Zhang’s call for a manhunt? No. I think he’s overreacting quite a bit. But Chinabounder pretty much had this kind of reaction coming to him. You reap what you sow.

  7. So china boys are jealous about a foreigner showing how in the land of Tao… chinesse men lack common sex knowlege. They are afraid that chinesse women gain their sexual independece and fredom

  8. I wonder if the bounder ever read “The Lifes and Loves of Frank Harris” and wants to make a name for himself. You could say all ‘Canadians are weird, all Australians are drunks, all New Zealanders (and Welsh) are sheep shaggers) all Brits are jerks’ – just quoting from another blog I recently read.

    Best regards
    A fat arsed lao wei (Welsh sheep shagging British jerk)

  9. Just another lynching by Chinese men filled with inferiority complex or 2 concerning foreigners shagging with their pure traditional women. Gag me please.

    Remember the fiasco over Japanese men’s partying with local prostitutes in Zhuhai couple of years ago and how much angst it brought out? I was in Dongguan at the time and it was so common to find prostitutes in KTVs, hotel (just call front desk), hotel sauna, street and barbershops… What’s the big deal? It really comes down to “WE THE LOCAL CHINESE MEN DO NOT WANT FOREIGNERS TO FXCK OUR GIRLS”. XENOPHOBIC as usual.

    I for 1 found shagging Chinese girls in mainland to be bit of eye opening experience having been to China 3-4 times per year from 1998 to 2004 on business. What surprised me was that most girls were open to sex and initiated it which I didn’t find in other Asian countries as I did business thru out asia from mid 80’s to 2004. This is mainland PRC phenomenon and not all overseas Chinese deal. They knew I was married and all but I was proposed couple of times and these 2 girls wanted 1 things – sex. I asked few girls I meet at hotel and at host company like secretaries and I shagged most of the girls I dated. Again I did not see this in other Asian countries. One secretary even complained that my dick was not too big in rather matter of fact manner. First time I heard such utter in my life.

    Another aspect was that Chinese men’s sexual approach in bed was bit boring especially when it came to oral sex. I guess Chinese men like other men like to receive but do not give. With some hesitation girls let me give them oral sex and it has been bliss to see them enjoy it so much and even ask for it. I’ve heard earful of complaints about their boyfriend and even husband’s lack of prowess of sort but I think what Chinese women craved most is foreign man’s sincere interest in them and appreciation and treating them like a lady. So not much sex per say but how a women would like to be treated.

    Back to yet another moronic lynching in China, alas, it those calling for some kind a justice only looked at themselves in the mirror…

  10. Simply put: protecting the chastity and morality of a society’s women is for the benefit of men – men that want a “clean” and “pure” virgin for a wife and can’t handle the thought of a) another man touching their loved one, and b) not equating to that image.

    Well, to some extent it is for society’s protection … why should any man have to support some else’s bastard. The age old insistence on marrying a virgin helps prevent that …

    When women routinely give men DNA tests of their children men will have the same paternity assurance as women have maternity assurance, and they can then relax their requirements, n’est pas?

  11. @All: Nice to see some of this battle has spilled over here, as it’s flooded near every site that’s posted about it. I saw the “Professor” on Shanghai news the other night. It made prime time here. Crazy.

    @Steve: Cheers for the link – I trust it’s at HHR already 😉

    @Phoebe: Where’d you see that. I think I read it too, but not sure if you just told me about it.

    @Loki: If you’re worried a kid isn’t yours, you’ve got bigger problems in your relationship than whether your wife-to-be is a virgin or not. My quote above was not meant to be take to mean that people need to have completely lose morals and just fuck everyone they see without thought of consequence, but it was meant to say that people should be considered smart enough to take their sexuality into their own hands (har har) and not have society tell them they are somehow less because they’ve had sex before they were married.

  12. Ryan said:

    @Loki: If you’re worried a kid isn’t yours, you’ve got bigger problems in your relationship than whether your wife-to-be is a virgin or not. My quote above was not meant to be take to mean that people need to have completely lose morals and just fuck everyone they see without thought of consequence, but it was meant to say that people should be considered smart enough to take their sexuality into their own hands (har har) and not have society tell them they are somehow less because they’ve had sex before they were married.

    Well, that all very glib, but it doesn’t change the fact that in a very homogenous race like the Chinese, women have far more opportunity to cheat on their partners/husbands because there is less likelyhood that they will be discovered than women in some other groups, like Caucasians. And we have evidence that misstated paternity is as high as 30% among low SES individuals in the US.

    As they say, “Trust, but verify!” DNA tests do that. Moreover, male and female behavior evolves over time in concert with each other, and since males as a group are more prone to violence than females, it may be that in the past in China most females have had to give up the potential to be supported by one poor sap while having children with men with better genes because of that very high possibility of violence by kuckolded males. C’est la vie.

  13. “I’ll admit that my only knowledge previously of Sex in Shanghai was a mix of resentment and envy that his blog was constantly on China Blog List’s top 10, and I’ve not been. Incidentally I’m considering changing the title of my blog to “Super Sex In Shanghai”.”

    Hahaha I know! SiS is still #1 though, even though his site’s password-protected. I think I’ll change my blog’s name to “OMG WTF!!! it’s a Hot Girl Teaching English in China!!!”. Pretty clever, yeah?

  14. Maybe these naive local Chinese girls need to read my blog to satisfy their ignorant curiosity. So much easier than learning the TRUTH the hard way… Sincerely, Rebecca Yu

  15. One secretary even complained that my dick was not too big in rather matter of fact manner. I rest my case. Most rice kings are sexually-insecure and seek validation from us Asian women because they believe we are more naive and forgiving. Well, maybe we are…the first time or 2…but we also catch on fast!

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  17. Pingback: The Sex Is Back: Return of Chinabounder | Lost Laowai China Blog

  18. I have met many girls that called themselves traditional chinese girls. The only tradition that they all shared was shedding their panties 5 minutes after coming home with me.
    What a wonderful tradition. I love this place.

  19. Pingback: Sex in Shanghai | Jottings from the Granite Studio

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